I'm an engineer who designs powertrain components for big trucks.  And I'm bored.  What do you want to know?

"Boss2452stolemylunchmoney" (boss2452stolemylunchmoney) 02/20/2016 at 11:09 • Filed to: None

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Caveat... I won’t reveal confidential information. You know, can’t bite the hand that feeds and all.

Tapas > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:11

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Pancakes or waffles?

atfsgeoff > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:12

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Who, in your opinion, makes the most robust HD diesel engines today?

Xyl0c41n3 > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:13

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Do you like/collect Tonka trucks?

Why/how did you get into engineering components for big trucks?

Has any of your work ever been featured in one of those “How it’s made” type shows in an episode that talks about big trucks?

XJDano > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:15

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Do you get to drive the trucks? I imagine they are kind of a pain in the ass since they have such a large foot print.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > Tapas 02/20/2016 at 11:15

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Pancakes... For sure. But I’m not a huge fan of syrup, which could have easily tipped this in favor of waffles; waffles clearly hold the syrup better.

Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:16

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Do you put ketchup on the side or on top of your fries?

How’d you get into your field?

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > atfsgeoff 02/20/2016 at 11:18

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Um... Really depends on the specific engine. For on-Highway, I would go with Cummins. For off-highway, it’s probably really dependent on who manufactured the machine... The system integration can really make a big difference in how the engine performs.

daender > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:19

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Seen any good pictures of when those big powertrains fail spectacularly?

JGrabowMSt > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:19

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How are the ring gears made for the rear differentials in those behemoths?

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras 02/20/2016 at 11:20

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I dip, but usually I don’t eat my fries with ketchup. Sometimes I dip them in Mayo because I’m crazy.

Dumb luck. I moved back to my home town after college and was looking for a job everywhere and landed on this industry just by happenstance. I’ve loved it though.

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:20

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How do you jack those things up to change a tire? Juvenile question I know but I've always wondered.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > XJDano 02/20/2016 at 11:23

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I’ve driven some of the smaller ones, 40-70 ton payload class, but not the ones I work on now, 240-400 ton class. They’re pretty easy to drive, though it is pretty nervous at first because you realize you could roll over pretty much anything without much warning. BuT they have tight turning circles, so they’re pretty easy to maneuver.

MM54 > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:27

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I briefly worked in a place manufacturing some of the drivetrain components for such vehicles, so no question, just a hello.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > Xyl0c41n3 02/20/2016 at 11:28

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No, although my company does have die casts made and I have a few of those.

Dumb blind stinking luck. I went on an interview shortly after graduating college with basically no experience except Formula challenge and manufacturing in a machine shop. The job was like a shop floor logistics engineering position. The next day, the manager for the heavy structures (frames) offered me a job as a design engineer. Since then I moved on to steering, suspension, brief stint as regulations and compliance, and now onto dedicated power train. I’ve had a lot of satisfaction in this work, and the work environment is mostly very positive, so I’m glad to be here.

Yes, probably a few of them. Mega factories is the one I can think of.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 02/20/2016 at 11:30

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Very large bottle jacks. Sometimes they’ll use over head cranes.

whoarder is tellurium > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:31

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Manual or Automatic?

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > daender 02/20/2016 at 11:32

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I have. We design it the best we can and are always looking for ways to improve things. But sometimes shit breaks. Usually though, things have to be so bad that the maintenance personnel should have noticed the problem long before it gets to the point of catastrophic failure.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > MM54 02/20/2016 at 11:33

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Hi!

FastIndy > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:34

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What’s the most challenging aspect of your job? Do you ever have problems letting part of your design go and calling it “good enough”?

I’m an engineer also, except in the aircraft testing environment, so I generally get to follow anything I design from cradle to grave, until its use has expired. I imagine that’s a little different in the production world.

In a Mini; let them mock me as My Mini Countryman is higher than you > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:35

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Alma mater?

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > JGrabowMSt 02/20/2016 at 11:36

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Very similarly to how they’re made in small cars. Just larger. They’re forged to near net shshape, machined, then heat treated. They actually are not as big as you’d expect because we use final drive gear reduction in the wheels.

camaroboy68ss > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:37

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Are you doing all your design work in 3D software or are you still using good ol AutoCAD? I work creating part drawings for exterior skins for high rise buildings and right now its a tooth and nail battle to go 3D

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > FastIndy 02/20/2016 at 11:41

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I’m guessing we have similar design demands as far as cradle to grave. The most challenging aspect is that our customers literally expect our parts to last forever. They’ll run these machines over 100,000 hours. And if a part fails on a machine that is 20 years old, we have to be able to provide a replacement part. So, from where I sit, planned obsolescence sounDS kind of nice. But, I don’t get that luxury.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > In a Mini; let them mock me as My Mini Countryman is higher than you 02/20/2016 at 11:41

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Wash U in St Louis.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > whoarder is tellurium 02/20/2016 at 11:41

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Automatic only.

JGrabowMSt > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:43

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Would there ever be a LWB version, maybe an El Camino style monster dump truck?

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > camaroboy68ss 02/20/2016 at 11:43

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We use Creo Parametric. Solid modeling only. We convert to 2d for manufacturing prints, but it’s a huge pain. Can’t wait until we go to 3D PDF for manufacturing.

Gone > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:43

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If you work for Liebherr, the coal mining guys would like the haul trucks to stop catching fire (electric drive units are the issue), just an FYI.

Any thoughts on powertrain efficiencies that could be had with terrain mapping when combined with automation? I know Komatsu has a number of haul trucks that are automated in various mines - I’m sure there’s others that do this as well. Just not sure if anyone is pushing the boundaries with powetrain integration, efficiency, and automation though.

Automating mining equipment is a pretty big deal, as you know. Especially if it can avoid incidents like at NARM in Oct ‘14(?) when a haul truck driver purposely (most likely) drove off a high wall.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > JGrabowMSt 02/20/2016 at 11:45

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You Aussies...

f86sabre > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:48

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what is the max torque you have seen +/-?

JGrabowMSt > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 11:52

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Not quite

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > Gone 02/20/2016 at 11:59

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I don’t work for leibherr, but thanks for the feedback!

Yes automation is huge. Especially in Australia where the goal is to never have a person in the pit. Still years away from that goal, though. You can be certain that if there is a way to increase the amount of material hauled per the amount of fuel used, we are working on it. I don’t have personal knowledge of terrain mapping being used for that purpose, but I could Invision it.

I had not heard about that NARN incident, but that is terrible!

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > f86sabre 02/20/2016 at 12:02

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Oh man, I don’t know. All I ever see are megapascals and meganewtons and microstrain. Engine performance is always quoted in horsepower, rated speed, and torque rise.

atfsgeoff > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 12:11

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For super large off-highway trucks, what are the benefits of gargantuan pneumatic tires vs tracks? Obviously the tires let the trucks go faster, but isn’t surface pressure and traction an issue, particularly in rainy areas?

camaroboy68ss > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 12:19

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yeah we are having the same issues, none of our manufacturers will take 3d models yet. plus we are having to shrink parts in house for checking only to have them blown back to full scale when it goes to the manufacturer

BaconSandwich is tasty. > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 12:29

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Gah, kinja on mobile. What is the most complicated part you have worked on?

A

Wh

Gone > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 12:36

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I did automation integration in mining for awhile (not haul trucks). You’re right. Aussies are huge on it and getting everybody out of the pit. I used to know all those Aussie regs by heart. Automation has uptime, quality, energy consumption, and consistency benefits.

As far as Liebherr, I’ve seen a few fires and toasted trucks. I think coal dust gets in the armature and then catches fire. My guess... They have badass route and clip on their vehicles though...damn Germans... Coal dust gets freaking EVERYWHERE. Also is freaky working right next to the ANFO trucks. Get that crap out of my work area, weirdo explosives guys.

Cool NARM weather photo for your time. I can’t share many of my mining pics lol.

Tapas > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 12:36

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Oh :(

Syrup is ok. I just like waffles better because they have abit of crisp to them and they hold syrup.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > JGrabowMSt 02/20/2016 at 13:06

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You got me there. Please give me a geography lesson.

epidemike > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 13:10

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How would you explain the powertrain to someone that has no mechanical knowledge?

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 13:21

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I don’t really have a question but think the scale and design of these are nuts. very cool

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 13:29

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I like the truck in this video.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > camaroboy68ss 02/20/2016 at 13:56

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Our casting and forging suppliers generally use our 3D models even if the print is fully detailed. The models are just easier.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > Gone 02/20/2016 at 14:03

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Yeah, I can’t share my photos either. Such is life.

Aussies are leading the way in terms of safety. The task based risk assessments are a big deal, butbut I really think they’re a good thing for all manufacturers to do.

Fire is still a really big variable on mining equipment, that’s why routings are so important. Keep those hydraulic lines healthy.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > atfsgeoff 02/20/2016 at 14:22

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Tires are always better. Higher speeds, less maintenance, lower fuel consumption. If it’s wet enough to need tracks, you’re site manager needs to work harder. Rainy areas can be challenging, but even then, the customers aren’t begging for tracks.

this is not matt farah's foxbodymiata > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 14:52

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Is there much consideration of going full electric on this kind of equipment anytime soon? Knowing absolutely nothing about the industry, it seems like a good idea to me. I’m sure the trucks, like any diesels, spend a lot of time time idling so you’d save right off the bat. Plus you could integrate torque vectoring AWD (idk if traction is much of an issue) and regenerative brake down into the mine, and I doubt your first concern is lightweighting so a big ass battery might not be impossible to justify.

I know fleet situations like this, where the vehicles drive a pretty constant distance per day and and spend the night in the same place are often well suited for battery power. Or do they tend to run the mines all night making charging impossible?

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 14:54

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Do you work on electric drivetrains or mechanical ones? I’m assuming you work on mining trucks and not road going trucks

Autofixation > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 15:10

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What do these trucks use for brakes?

How big are the pistons?

What is the most common engine layout? (V12, V16)

What is the engine displacement?

How many speeds?

Also, my Dad was a tax rep for Ashland Coal, now Arch coal, in WV. Every so often he would have to make a site visit to look at the equipment. He would take me and my brothers along. Those things are gigantic!

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > BaconSandwich is tasty. 02/20/2016 at 15:38

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Differential. For sure. But, really I haven’t done much work on gear trains yet. I’ve done a lot of work with plain bearings in the past and sealing them, keeping them lubricated, and getting the wear rate under control is actually pretty complicated.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 02/20/2016 at 15:39

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Mechanical, we have a dedicated electrical drive train team.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > epidemike 02/20/2016 at 15:41

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It’s the parts of the machine that make it go and stop and change direction. I work on lower powertrain, which includes brakesbrakes, suspension, differential, wheels, and final drives.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > Autofixation 02/20/2016 at 15:46

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Brakes are multiple plate wet clutch type with liquid cooling.

Pistons are like 7" or something, they’re big.

Cylinder count depends on the size. Our trucks are 6 cylinder with approximately 400 HP all the way up to 24 cylinders and 4000 HP.

Oh man, not even sure... Smallest engines are 15 liters. I think the biggest might be 105 liters.

6-8 speeds depending on model.

Yeah they are. Some describe it as driving a house around.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 15:47

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Do you work for cat? I think they are the only manufacturer who uses mechanical drivetrains. I was actually a test engineer for cat’s mining trucks

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 02/20/2016 at 15:49

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Yeah... But don’t tell anyone, I’m not a company spokesman. Sweet! I loved visiting the proving grounds.

BaconSandwich is tasty. > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 16:26

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I can imagine so. I’ve always wondered how bearings on a ship's propeller shaft are made to prevent water from getting in.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 16:29

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Yea it was a fun job. If I could have moved that job near where my family was I’d still be working there. Ever been down there?

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > this is not matt farah's foxbodymiata 02/20/2016 at 17:16

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This is a great post.

A lot of trucks have electric drivetrains. They’re more efficient when used in downhill loaded situations because the cooling grid is more efficient than mechanical drivetrains liquid coolers. Some mines actually use big trolley type electric power units to power the trucks, so the engines don’t need to be used.. That said, battery technology is no where close to being able to run these machines without engines out even with a hybrid set up. There’s just too much energy at play.

Lightweighting is actually a big deal on these machines. The tires limit the amount of mass that can be placed in the bodybody; so if the machine is lighter, more material can be placed in the body. Simply increasing the tire size isn’t an option as the tires are already a significant concern for space claim.

These machines usually operate 24/7. They only stop for operator breaks, fuel, and maintenance.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > BaconSandwich is tasty. 02/20/2016 at 17:17

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Very large shaft seals, I would imagine.

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 02/20/2016 at 17:17

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Yup, a few times. It’s a very nice place and I actually enjoy the weather.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 18:50

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So do you work on a certain series or just across the entire range?

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 02/20/2016 at 18:53

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Yeah, I have one model I’m responsible for, but my co-workers and I share responsibility too on certain things. if there are projects that span multiple models, our supervisor doesn’t want us all in the samemeetings, so one of us will work across models in that scenario. s

In a Mini; let them mock me as My Mini Countryman is higher than you > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 19:09

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W what was your sat score??!!!

Boss2452stolemylunchmoney > In a Mini; let them mock me as My Mini Countryman is higher than you 02/20/2016 at 19:39

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I took the ACT. My score wasn’t good. Like 25 maybe. I transferred to wash u from another school, so my previous education made up for my low test score.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Boss2452stolemylunchmoney 02/20/2016 at 19:47

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Cool. Well if you’re ever at the proving grounds again say hi to the LMT team for me